[E196] Help! We're Not On The Same Parenting Page

[00:00:04] Speaker A: Welcome to the Empowered to Connect podcast, where we come together to discuss a healing centered approach to engagement and well being for ourselves, our families, and our communities. [00:00:18] Speaker B: Hey, guys. Tona Ottinger here, and I'm excited - we are in studio in real life, sitting in chairs, looking at each other in person with Becca McKay and Jesse Faris. And we are going to start having a conversation I'm really excited to have today. Although if I'm a little honest, it's a bit of a tricky conversation for me. So our topic today is help or not on the same parenting page. So as we get started with that topic, I'm guessing we're experiencing some feelings and maybe a little bit of like, oh, no. So let's do a bit of a check in. So the first thing I want to ask is when you hear that idea of, like, being on the same parenting page with your spouse or parenting partner, the person that is just your closest parenting support, what comes up in you? So what? What is it? Do a little feeling check in. Tell me how you're feeling when you think about that topic, and then we can kind of dive in. Jesse, you're up. [00:01:16] Speaker C: All right, I'm up. I parent with my husband Nick, and he is also an ETC trainer. Maybe occasionally you've heard him on the podcast. The feeling that it pulls up in me... I dislike conflict, y'all. I'm an Enneagram 2. It's hard for me to feel anger or to even, like, disagree with someone. So when I feel disagreement and conflict, I feel afraid. So I think that's what I feel is fear when that topic comes up. [00:01:52] Speaker B: Becca, what about you? When you think about, like, syncing up and getting on the same page with, with Rico, what comes to mind? [00:01:59] Speaker A: I have not seen Inside Out 2 yet, but I've seen the, like, clips of the Anxiety just, like, going nuts in the control room, like, grabbing for the panel. And so I think what comes to my mind is, like, this big desire to control, like, how Rico feels, how I feel. We are not parents yet, but we've been doing a lot of work to try to get on the same page in preparation for parenting and just in other things that we've had to get on the same page on, it's like, ooh, this takes a lot of work. So I'm picturing the little Anxiety Inside Out character. [00:02:30] Speaker B: Like, she's the best movie. [00:02:33] Speaker A: She's, like, grabbing. I haven't seen it yet, but, yeah. [00:02:37] Speaker B: I think I have. Like, I don't mean this is a cop out, but when I do a check in, and I think about feelings. It feels like a whole lot of feelings. So I have a very big sense of both/and. Mo and I have been parenting together. Our oldest child is 24, and I remember that second, I mean, we started our parenting journey in South Korea. And in that scenario, the way that it was structured was we were... We met our kiddo one day for, like, an hour and picked them up the next day, and then we had to get on a plane the next morning. [00:03:16] Speaker C: Oh, my. [00:03:16] Speaker B: So we had less than 24 hours together before we got on a plane. And I just remember driving away and being in the taxi and looking at him and being like, why do they think we should be parents? And we were like, what are we doing? And so I think the journey of, like, syncing up with Mo probably could be summarized in 24 years of what are we doing? Which may or may not make you want to stop listening right now to the Empowered to Connect podcast, which focuses a lot on parenting. Truth of the matter is, it is such a fluid interpersonal dynamic between Mo and I as we have navigated parenting for 24 years. So it's a whole lot of both/and. [00:04:07] Speaker C: So something you may not know is I actually have two extra weeks of experience in parenting than Nick does... Jesse press his buttons? I I pull that up. I don't pull it up very often. [00:04:20] Speaker B: Because you went ahead, Nick, right? [00:04:22] Speaker C: I did. We, our first child, we adopted from Ethiopia, we met her together. But then when we went back about six weeks later to Ethiopia, I had extra time away from paid work, and he had less time to take. And so our agreement was I would go two weeks ahead of him, and I took my mother with me. We took custody of our daughter. And I remember that, like, oh my goodness. Maybe everybody feels this way when in the first 24 hours of their parenting experience, they're like, I've made a huge mistake. [00:04:58] Speaker B: Oh, really? Truly! You're like, who thinks anybody should ever be in charge of keeping another human alive? [00:05:03] Speaker C: It was such a weird experience to do this dial up Internet at our guest house and get these emails from Nick, living our old normal life. And I was living our new normal life that he didn't know; he hadn't experienced yet. And he would be like, "I can't wait to get over there and have some r and r with you guys." And I'm like, r and r?! "Get out while you can", you know. [00:05:26] Speaker B: Oops, that flight was canceled. [00:05:29] Speaker C: It was such a weird thing. And you talking about that made me think about, like, that really is such a great, like, callback to me of like, boy, that was just two different universes. And sometimes being on different pages on anything with parenting can feel like that. [00:05:45] Speaker B: Exactly. [00:05:46] Speaker C: Like you are living two different experiences. [00:05:48] Speaker B: I would love to see what would happen between you and Nick if you were to be like, I am a more experienced parent than you. [00:05:54] Speaker C: Oh, my goodness. [00:05:54] Speaker B: I just wish I could be in the room to sort of see that. [00:05:57] Speaker C: You do not. You do not want to see that. [00:05:59] Speaker B: The next time we're out to dinner or something, I'm going to be like, hey, Jesse and Nick, how long have you all been parenting? And you can speak, give it to. [00:06:06] Speaker A: Me by week, like, whatever he says. Plus two weeks. [00:06:08] Speaker B: That's right. [00:06:09] Speaker C: 14 years. Plus two. [00:06:10] Speaker A: Plus two weeks. [00:06:11] Speaker B: I love it. Okay, so when we think about this idea of sort of getting on the same page, or maybe if we're not on the same page, let's talk about maybe some of those pain points and how do we approach those pain points? How do we feel them? How do we experience them? How do we see them? And then maybe how do we approach them? What comes to mind for y'all? [00:06:33] Speaker C: Who's going to start this one, ya'll? [00:06:35] Speaker B: Bring it to me. Jess? [00:06:37] Speaker C: I think. I think the pain point for me, and this is probably for communication in general and also marriage in general, is when you're on a different page with parenting, you usually think you're right and your spouse thinks they're right. And that's coming from somewhere, right? It's coming from your histories. It's coming from what's hardwired within you, your attachment styles. It's coming from your beliefs about your values. And. Yeah, it's so deep. It's such a deep thing within each of you. And so usually there's like, do we adopt or not? Is it time to become parents or not? Are we.. or I don't know, which school should we put our kid in? Or all of those things. Like, I don't know, what are some other things that you can immediately think of that you could be on a different page? I think you're approaching it and part of it is a surprise. The pain point is surprise because I think, I tend to assume everyone thinks the way I think. Right, right. So it's the surprise of like, what, somebody. [00:08:02] Speaker B: Exactly. [00:08:03] Speaker C: You see it differently? [00:08:04] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:08:04] Speaker C: But then also maybe some disappointment of like, oh, man. And I think maybe even this desire to, like, control the outcome of, like, well, I'm gonna have to get what I want. Cause clearly it's the right way. You know, it's really hard to kind of pull all that apart and figure out, like, where's this coming from? How can I respect, you know, the other side, and how are we gonna move forward? How does the decision get made? [00:08:31] Speaker B: Let's think about. I mean, what I appreciate about what you're saying is the highlighting of how the reality of being on different pages, if we just wanna use that language, can show up in so many different ways throughout seasons. Decisions, interactions, interpersonal dynamics. Like, we are two human beings sort of being asked to steward care for, connect, build something together. And what does it look like to maybe just come in eyes wide open? Like, we are really gonna see probably most everything from two different vantage points. And I think if I'm going hit and rewind, those were some of our first epiphanies. It wasn't even about the decision and how it got made or I sort of what kind of parenting is right and what's wrong, or what do our kids even need? It was, oh, you're different than me. And I think when you're maybe operating pre-parenting, you know, that's true. Like, there are some things within marriage that highlight that, but it is thrown into high relief when we're navigating another human being's well being, emotional health, and how we would approach that. Becca, what comes to mind for you? [00:09:57] Speaker A: Well, it's like we're in the pre-parenting phase, and so. But getting on the same page in a lot of areas has taken a lot of work for us. We are from different backgrounds. I grew up in a different country. He. We are different races. We have different mindsets about almost everything. And so it's taken so much work to get on the same page. I think so many of our close friends tell us "parenting is the thing we argue about the most." So I think that that is probably related to the pressure you just described. Like, it's so much pressure to be responsible for a human person. And I think parents carry with them the weight of, like, people will judge me based on my child's choices. People will judge me based on my child's accomplishments. People will judge me based on my reactions in public to my child. And so there's so much, like, inner turmoil, and so getting on the same page is so important, but it's so hard because, like, you guys both said this. You don't know what you don't know. You don't know what you're gonna be on the same page about and what you're not. And so I think, like, just opening those conversations. I think Rico and I are unique in that we're a little older than a lot of our friends who got married young, and we're a little bit more sure of ourselves, but still, there's a lot of, like, conversations that have to be had about a lot of things. And so when it comes to parenting, it's, like, what is within our sphere of influence? What do we have to agree on? What is it? Okay. When you're, before you're parenting, it's like, even if you really disagree about something, even if it's big, kind of, there's, like, a safety net of, like, you can do you and still be married to someone, you know? Like, there's a little bit of freedom. [00:11:43] Speaker B: Of, like, maybe the stakes are a little lower. [00:11:47] Speaker A: Like, I can hate sometimes that you do. Like, and let's use a silly example. Like, I can hate that you, like a certain tv show, but at the end of the day, like, you do you, man, I'm never gonna watch it with you, but, like, that's on you. But when you're parenting, it is such a, like, team thing that you're doing when you're parenting with a partner. And so there's so much pressure. And then I think, yeah, I just think when you think about the outcome of that, like, there's fear about. Well, no, you said it, Jesse. I'm right about this. And if you do it your way, you're gonna damage our kids. You're gonna harm our kids. You're gonna coddle our kids. You're gonna spoil our kids. There's so much else, yeah, there's so much else with it. [00:12:25] Speaker C: You were talking about. It's such a team thing. And to me, that pulls out two other parts that are at play when you're talking about parenting, which is: you've got your style of communication at play. Like, probably all three of us have different communication styles within our marriage. You know, like, how direct do you talk about direct things? Do you feel, you know, like, how through the side door, back door, do you feel like you have to go when you talk about potential points of conflict, or do you talk about it at all? Or, you know, do you push through a conversation? You know, all of that. So you've got your communication style. I'm also thinking, like, you also have your own ideas, whether you've talked about them together or not, about whose responsibility does the parenting fall upon. Like, obviously, it's both of you, but, like, who is the primary caregiver in your household? Who is, you know, like, in that. [00:13:26] Speaker B: Who changes the diapers, who puts the kids to bed? [00:13:29] Speaker C: Who holds the mental load of, like, thinking about all of the things. [00:13:36] Speaker B: Who's Planning the summer schedule? Exactly, so much, Jess. [00:13:39] Speaker C: And so I think this blew wide open in Covid, where you had a lot of parents at home together, and, like, ideally, you'd be sharing all of that, and everybody had their own responsibilities that they were responsible for at home. But I think it maybe kind of highlighted some differences in opinion of how responsibility falls. So that in itself can be fraught of, like, whose responsibility is this? Are we gonna talk about that or are we going to just assume it? And is our assumption the same? [00:14:14] Speaker B: So let's think about. I think what I'm hearing us say is that this is a tricky situation because it's. The stakes are, you know, pretty high. They're. They're important, like, parenting and building our family and stewarding our family space and the way that we operate as a family is a high value. And you're trying to sync up all of that with another person. There are going to be sticky and tricky spots. If you're being honest and if you're communicating and if you're feeling safe enough to do that, there's going to be some struggles. So let's talk about how do we navigate those. Like, how do we, what are some of the tools or strategies or examples that we can think of that we've had to pull into to move forward? I think about how important it is to feel autonomous in marriage even or in that kind of a relationship. So how do we get to maintain a sense of self and identity and desires and hopes and personality while honoring and taking care of and loving well somebody that might see it different? Let's talk about some of those times. Can you all think of some situations and scenarios? [00:15:37] Speaker A: The first thing that pops to my mind is a little bit of a big picture, which is just a little bit of a... If you feel like you're not on the same page with a parenting partner, if you're parenting with a partner, I just don't think you're alone. So I hope first you just hear. I think that's really common. [00:15:53] Speaker B: That's kind of everybody. [00:15:54] Speaker A: I think it's everybody. [00:15:55] Speaker B: And at least some way, we're with you. [00:15:56] Speaker C: We're all in this together. [00:15:57] Speaker B: It's either happening in big ways or it's happening in small, small ways, but it's happening. [00:16:01] Speaker A: And I think that there's a little bit of, like, I just. I think, I want to say like, give yourself compassion. If you feel specifically with connected parenting, like you're further along the journey, and if you feel like your partner is behind, I want to say, like, enter this with a lot of grace, because coming in strong with "you're not doing it right, and you're going to do irreparable harm to our family" is probably not the way to open the conversation. So I would just say starting, give yourself a lot of grace, and give your partner a lot of grace. We come into situations with our whole life experiences with us. So that's my first thing that I would want to say, is just come into the space with a lot of grace. And then I think, where do you go from there? [00:16:47] Speaker C: I agree with that. When you're saying it, it's making me think about how we kind of have a standard or guideline in our Facilitator Training for our parenting course, Cultivate Connection. Shout out to Cultivate Connection Facilitators. [00:17:01] Speaker B: That's right. [00:17:02] Speaker C: And that guideline or standard is, hey, listen, if one spouse is going through this course to become a facilitator, we want both spouses going through the course, because it's almost going to do more harm for one person to get on this page and the other person is living that different experience, it's going to create extra friction and tension. And so I think anytime I.. I think anytime Nick and I have parenting differences of opinion, or we're not on the same page, I love how you keep saying sync up. That truly is the process. And it's not that I need to get on his page, meaning agree with his opinion. [00:17:52] Speaker B: Right. [00:17:53] Speaker C: We need to get to a place where we have an understanding of the other's viewpoint and to make a collective decision. And I think that takes a grace, like you're saying, Becca. And I think it takes time and space, and that can feel really uncomfortable because you're kind of living in this space of waiting for another person and they're waiting for you. So I'm thinking of maybe when one of us has wanted to do something, you know, when one of us has been ready to adopt and the other one wasn't ready, it wasn't like, well, one person just gets their way. It was like we were gonna sit in that space and sync up. And sync up. [00:18:43] Speaker B: Yep. [00:18:43] Speaker C: It's like, what does that mean, though, Tona, what do you think that means when it means to sync up? [00:18:48] Speaker B: I love that. It's interesting that you use that example about maybe even growing your family, because a time and season in our life is like, rolling around in my head for me. And it was in. We were a family of six, so we had our older four kids at that time, and there was just a deep growing desire in me. I just didn't feel like our family was finished. And there's more reasons than I can explain today, but our older kids are all within four years of each other. There was a lot going on. There was a high level of need. Mo and I were in a season of, like, a lot of parenting change. Like, we knew this is when we were, like, really stripping stuff away, really breaking stuff down, really hitting reset. So I look back at that and I think both of us were undergoing construction. That's just ridiculous analogy. But that's what it probably felt like to us. Like, we aren't really doing this the way we want to, and we need some time. And we had those other children's relationships that we were navigating, and we were pursuing them relationally, and that happens at different paces with different parents. So another episode, conversation about attachment and maybe the journey of that and how it looks really differently, but there were some needs and maybe some. A lack of some secure relationships in the way that maybe we would want them to be. But nonetheless, like my heart and feelings and thoughts were, we're not quite done. And then, lo and behold, you know, fell in love with a couple of kiddos internationally. Those are now our children. But my first conversations with Mo about that possibility, he had more hesitation than I did. And granted, we'd been parenting then, you know, I don't even know, 14 years together or something. We'd been on the journey for a while, and I didn't get frustrated with him or annoyed or aggravated or "You're gonna keep me from getting my dream." You know, it wasn't about me winning and him losing. It was something altogether different, which was, hey, I want us to figure out how to get on the same page or sync up. I really like maybe that language better because it's a different page. I don't know. It's a different kind of flow and rhythm. [00:21:12] Speaker C: No one's getting on one person. Yeah, exactly. You're reaching a different page. [00:21:17] Speaker B: Yeah, you're thinking up, and, yeah, you don't have to think just alike. And he would not mind me sharing this. I believe he has shared this on an episode prior, but he basically said, I feel like I have some relational repair and work to do with one of our kiddos, and I do not feel like it's a good idea for our family or for me. To change the dynamic while we're in this season of moving forward. How in the world can I be frustrated with that? I could have just been like, he doesn't want me, you know, to get my way, or there's just 1,000,001 ways I could have felt about that. But we had just been practicing. What does it mean to be reflective with our own selves when we're out of sync? That there's something going on in both of us? So can we both come together with that? And I just said, can we, can we talk about it once a week? Can we? And what can I do to help you feel like you're making the progress you want to make in this other relationship? And then we had some. Some action steps and some real things, and, like, we carved out time and maybe even put a little bit more intention around some of the healing work that needed to happen elsewhere. So I didn't feel like we stacked, like we weren't stagnating, and, oh, my goodness. I mean, everything really and truly did work out in the end. There were other bumps. I mean, there were other situations that came and went, but that first little love that I fell in love with is our youngest child, so. And we were a couple of years out from even being able to pursue her and then subsequently our other son. But I was so thankful that Mo was intuitive and mindful enough and, like, we'd practice What does it mean to be vulnerable and reflective? And we found our way. There are so many of those. That's a big one. That's one of those big. We're out of sync here. I can say in our family dynamics, I'm usually the one that's sort of wanting to go faster or grow a bigger family. And Mo is usually the restrictor plate, and hindsight's 2020, but man, oh, man, am I grateful for his restrictor plate. It didn't always feel good to not get my way in the moment or be told no or have a boundary or not yet. I don't always like that because of my personality, but, man, oh, man, hindsight 2020. I'm so grateful that we're wired differently and that we see situations from a different perspective. [00:23:48] Speaker A: So when I think about navigating. So Rico and I are in a name-all-the-emotions-in-the-world season, we were just very recently approved as a waiting adoptive family. Obviously, like, woo woo. [00:24:03] Speaker B: Can we do that a minute? Because Jesse and I kind of are losing our minds. We're so excited. [00:24:08] Speaker C: I'm so excited to be Auntie Tona. All on the becca McKay. Becca and Rico McKay. [00:24:13] Speaker B: Yeah, we are. So thank you. Hey, Becca, thank you for sharing that with our listeners. Like, we are celebrating and supporting you in this moment. Okay, go back to that. Sorry. [00:24:21] Speaker A: As you guys, I mean, as everyone can imagine, with my work being so closely related with adoption, foster care, this kind of world, it's something like, it's like when you learn a second language and you just know it, and you don't know how you know it, but you've just been immersed in it. And so there's, like, this adoption culture language that I've just kind of picked up on. There's things that I'm familiar with, and Rico is, like, not on a different page, but a different book. Like, I'm on a different book on this bookshelf. And so our journey towards even pursuing this has been a slow one. It's been about a three year journey of conversations and wondering and prayers and talking with our community, and it's something that we. We moved towards very slowly. So I think when I think about your question of how do you navigate when you're in different books around different pages, is I. You said it too, Tona. Like, I just let him set the pace. I figured out what opportunities were available, and I figured out what opportunities were available, and then I let him let us know when we could take the first step. It would have been easy for me to, like, fill out a packet and get everything together and hit go by myself, but I chose not to do that. Like, we did every step of the adoption process, every piece of paper, every meeting, we did it together. And that slowed us down in a really good way, because it ensured that we weren't some very different about Rico and I. I process things about two years in advance, and I want to talk about them, talk about them, talk about them, talk about them. Rico processes what's happening today, like, real time. Real time, not what's happening tomorrow, like, what's happening today. And so we have had to work really hard. We are in. We shared on an episode that we did together, that every six months, we're in, like, a regularly scheduled marriage counseling appointment, and parenting and adoption is something that we've been talking about in those appointments, and we've been trying some different things. Like, you said something, Tona, about, like, let's set a weekly appointment to talk about this. That's something our counselor suggested to us. He was like, hey, Becca, instead of texting Rico, every time you think about it or saying it every single day, could you, like, write him in a note on your phone and then bring them to him at certain times. So that has really been helpful because he can, like, get himself into the headspace to have the conversation. It's hard, you know, when it comes to parenting, what will parenting be like? We don't know what we don't know. I think what has helped Rico and I feel really at peace and confident. Like, we. I will say, and you guys can laugh at me when it doesn't happen this way. We have said that we don't think parenting is the thing we're going to argue about the most, and that's because we met each other working at a school. We have eleven nieces and nephews that we spend a lot of time with. [00:27:15] Speaker B: We both feel synced up a little bit. [00:27:16] Speaker A: We feel synced up when it comes to how we see kids. When I met Rico, he was a one on one paraprofessional for a student with significant disabilities in a school. And I saw the way that he walked with that kid every single day, like, before we even dated. [00:27:31] Speaker B: You fell in love with him as he was caring for 100%. Yeah. [00:27:36] Speaker A: On one of our first dates, he randomly started driving a different direction. I was like, where are we going? And he's like, well, you have to meet my nephew. Our nephew is like a one year old at the time. It was one of our, maybe our third date, and I texted my sisters, like, this might be the guy, because I would have done that on a date. I would have, like, wanted to share, you know, my kid friends with somebody. And so all of that to say, you don't know what you don't know. But I think what we have done is, like, we come from very different families, and we spent a lot of time with our families, and we've used that as a springboard of, like, not to judge any parenting decisions that my siblings or his siblings or my family or whatever, but we have a lot of conversations. What do we think about screen time for kids? What do we think about the kinds of school? What do we think about how much time they'll spend with other kids versus not? What do we think about vaccinations? What do we think about the foods that we'll be okay with eating like we've had, as it's come up, because we spend so much time with our family, we've had those conversations. What I think that does is, like, you guys will hold me while I'm crying one day because we'll have some major disagreement that we didn't anticipate and we have a rhythm now of, like, we just talk about things. We just process them. We do our best to try to understand. I have pretty big opinions about infants and screens. And Rico, when I first told him years ago, he was like, I completely disagree. And, like, very recently, he's been like, you know what? I think I'm starting to agree with you, Becca. And I wasn't like, it's okay if he didn't. But it's like, I said something I felt really strongly about. I said, why years ago, and then two or three years later, he's now like, you know what? Let's talk about that again. I think maybe I want to hear more. And so we have had the luxury of having this long time of processing and preparing that not everyone has. But I think the rhythms, the talking about things together, opening the conversation, being open if you have differences, but at least hearing each other out and hearing the why. 99.9, maybe 100% of parents want to be good parents. [00:29:39] Speaker B: I know. [00:29:40] Speaker A: Like, parents want to be good parents so you can sync up because you both want that baby to grow and be loved and be cared for. [00:29:48] Speaker B: You may disagree on how that happens, but the intention and desire is shared. Let me ask a question. So as we're thinking about all that we've said, what's a couple of nuggets or takeaways that you feel like might be important around this idea of syncing up with your parenting partner or spouse? [00:30:08] Speaker C: I want to respond to what Becca said real quick. Of course, before my takeaways. The first is, I think that that is what we call practicing outside of the moment. Oh, these conversations that you're having about, like, what would we do? What do you think about, like, we say we should do that with our kids, but guess what? We do it as adults all the time of, like, what would we do if that happened to you? Like, yeah, there's an opportunity for that. Also, is it too gimmicky to just say, like, hit subscribe if you would like to watch Becca's journey play out. [00:30:41] Speaker B: In real life, because here we go. [00:30:44] Speaker C: Like, maybe you have some listeners for life, Becca. I don't know. Thanks. [00:30:48] Speaker B: Okay, can I say this really quick? I was shopping, like, I don't know. It was a little while ago, and I found the cutest baby shoes. It's been a long time since I have had a reason to buy baby shoes. And I texted her, I was like, please tell me when I can buy baby shoes for the baby. So I don't know. We are going to be along for the journey. [00:31:07] Speaker C: Maybe all kinds of podcast listeners will be sending you baby shoes. Who knows? [00:31:11] Speaker B: Let's get Rico's order because Rico probably cares about shoes. Let's get Rico's shoe order and we'll place that in the, in the show notes. [00:31:19] Speaker A: Perfect - link to Nike. [00:31:22] Speaker C: We're all in your fan club together. Perfect. I think my takeaway, as I look through an ETC lens and I'm thinking about all of you listener friends, and I'm thinking about us and our three different viewpoints, I think I'm thinking of two things. So, first of all, Tona was talking about that surprise of like, discovering that when you are parenting with another human, you have two human people. You're different. And like, that is a shock to the marriage, a shock to, you know, the system when you discover that. I think the further down this road that I go, I have a lot more to go to, guys. So I'm in the middle of this. But I think I'm learning that two different people doing this is actually a strength. And, you know, you may be listening and you're thinking, well, I'm a, I'm a single parent, so there aren't two different people doing this. And I get that. And I also know that you have, like, you've got your village, right? You've got your people that you're listening to that you're going to for advice, that you've got your people that hold you, you know, and help care for you. And the other thing that I'm thinking is, in terms of that, is that this all goes back to me to secure attachment, because it's all about meeting each other's needs, allowing your partner to meet your needs. It's negotiating your needs. That example that Tona gave is Mo and Tona negotiating, like, here's where I am. Well, here's where I am. What do you need? And I think the healthiest differences that we have navigated as, as we attempt to parent are probably going to involve that negotiation of needs. And, you know, we can, we can caricature each other as, like, you know, she's the quick decider and he's, he's the, you know, she's the hasty one and he's the methodical one or whatever, however we caricature each other and in our relationships. But I think it's actually going to ebb and flow. I think there's going to be give and take. There have been things that we were on different pages about that Nick was further ahead than I was and had to be patient with me to maybe learn more about myself or to come to a different place to be ready and vice versa. So it is not just. It's not just one thing. Nobody's ever just one thing. [00:34:07] Speaker B: And I was hoping you were going to say that. That's, like, one of my favorite takeaways from you, Jesse. [00:34:12] Speaker C: Guys, we're not one dimensional. There's so many facets to us. So I guess I would encourage all of us, hey, let's think about the goal here, which is secure attachment for our relationships in general, our marriage and our parenting. [00:34:28] Speaker B: I love that. [00:34:29] Speaker C: And what does that mean? What's that going to require of us? [00:34:32] Speaker B: That's good, Jess. Becca, what about you? [00:34:34] Speaker A: Oh, man, you guys, it's hard to think. It's. When I get to this spot, I think what I'm thinking about is who clicked on an episode called 'we're not on the same page, help'. [00:34:44] Speaker A: And I'm thinking about you. [00:34:46] Speaker C: I clicked on that episode. [00:34:47] Speaker B: That's right. [00:34:48] Speaker A: Hi. But I'm thinking about you. And I'm thinking you're probably feeling exhausted and frustrated. If you clicked on this episode, you're probably feeling a little bit of angst, of like, why can't we be on the same page? Like Jesse said earlier, of, like, you might be feeling like, I'm right about this, or et cetera. I'm thinking about parents that are co parenting in separate households. I'm thinking of parents that are parenting in the same household. I'm thinking of folks that have extended family members, grandparents living in the home who are on different pages. And so whatever your circumstance is, I think two things that pop to my mind. One is an encouragement, which is that research shows that one safe adult can have a life changing impact on a kid. And so in situations where getting on the same page or syncing up isn't possible, I want you to know that it's not in vain to still use connection based approaches with your kids. [00:35:39] Speaker C: That's good advice. [00:35:40] Speaker A: Pursue secure attachment with your kids. [00:35:41] Speaker B: Jesse and I are shaking our head real hard. So ditto and ditto. Okay. Go ahead, Becca. Yep. [00:35:45] Speaker A: And then for those of you that are on the journey, you are syncing up. You're with someone who is, however slow it may be, you can work together to get there. I think listen to any of our episodes about how to connect with your kids and do the same thing with your parenting partner. Like, listen to understand, be emotionally and physically present, play together, disarm fear. Like, I think so much of getting in sync get curious, meet needs, negotiate needs so much. So much of this can come out as conflict or, like, harsh. But if we can take that same gentle, loving approach with each other, I just think that can set you up for success. Those would be my two takeaway kind of thoughts that are swimming around in my brain. [00:36:30] Speaker B: Golden. Okay, here's my closing thought. And it's been about this concept of fixed mindset and growth mindset. And again, you cannot control someone else, spouse or partner around whether or not they have a growth mindset or a fixed mindset. But this could be a concept it would be good for you to explore and learn about and maybe even just think about for yourself. Are you willing to change your mind? Are you willing to hear from somebody else and see something from a different point of view, can you empathize and see something from their vantage point and compromise and negotiate needs, and then maybe that is an interesting conversation starter, if that would be appropriate. Hey, in parenting, do we have a fixed mindset or a growth mindset and that might spur on and unlock some things that could be keeping y'all from syncing up. So that is just a concept and idea that comes to mind for me. Okay, here's our little checkout for today. So at the time of this episode recording, we are mid summer here in Memphis, Tennessee. And so we're going to do a little checkout question with the three of us. What is something that's giving you life right now? Mid summer in the heat.. I think yesterday might have been like a heat index record in Memphis, Tennessee. So what are we doing that's given us a little life, midsummer? [00:38:03] Speaker C: Guys, it's been a years long ritual of my kids and myself to go to the library once a week in the summers. We are not like big fancy vacation people. We maybe save up for a vacation that we take every couple years so far in the history of our family. And so we are always have that tricky moment of like, people ask our kids, like, what are you doing this summer? [00:38:32] Speaker B: Or we're going to the library. [00:38:34] Speaker C: Literally. That's what they say. Isn't that hilarious? And then, you know, my teenager now is complaining about it. She's like, mom, we're so lame. All I can tell people we did this summer is we went to the library. [00:38:46] Speaker B: That's amazing. [00:38:47] Speaker C: We go swimming and we do. We're about to go to camp next week. We don't do nothing. But anyways, what's giving me life is because I just realized this summer that my kids only think of the library as a place to get, like, fiction chapter books. So they had been complaining the last several weeks, like, I'd be like, all right, it's library day. You know, let's go. And they're like, we have enough books. We don't want to read anything else. And I'm like, oh, guys, guys. That is, like, such a small fraction of what the library is. [00:39:21] Speaker B: Are you telling me small minded? [00:39:23] Speaker C: Are you telling me you don't even know what's in these stacks anyways? Oh, my gosh. That's amazing. I have been introducing my kids to the nonfiction section, even the adult nonfiction sections of the library. I'm like, what are you interested in? My teenager likes theater, so we're finding all these manuscripts of plays and monologues for teens. And look up. All you got to do is look up something, and you find the call number, and then you find a whole section. [00:39:51] Speaker B: I'm sorry, did you just do a throwback to card catalog call numbers? [00:39:55] Speaker C: We're talking about the dewey decimal system and. [00:39:58] Speaker B: How it is giving me life. [00:40:00] Speaker C: I see you, like, for those of you who caricature me as the structure girl, this is not helping. I understand. [00:40:07] Speaker B: Sorry, but we may have just put a fine point on that. [00:40:10] Speaker C: Last week or the past couple weeks, my girls were joking that I had the magic ability of finding the perfect book for them, and I was like, oh, my gosh. This is the thing that gives me life. It's like the gift giving nature in me is like, I can give them a free gift by finding the perfect book for them at the library. Such something that gives me life. So, like, walking through the stacks and being like, here you go, Brooklyn. Here is a book on 150 ways to tie a rope. And she's like, what? This is in the library? [00:40:46] Speaker B: Who needs the Bahamas, Mom?! [00:40:48] Speaker C: I'm sorry. Everyone has stopped listening to this podcast at this moment. Maybe one of you is like, that's a cool idea. [00:40:56] Speaker B: No, I actually do love that. Thank you for sharing. I love it. That is amazing in every single way. [00:41:01] Speaker A: All right, Becca, my segue is that the book that Jesse picked out for me is called Tired of Being Tired. [00:41:08] Speaker B: Wait a minute. She picked that book out for you? She does. [00:41:10] Speaker C: Lend it to her. I love you guys. [00:41:13] Speaker B: This is amazing. [00:41:14] Speaker A: She said, and for you. [00:41:15] Speaker B: I'm tired of being tired [00:41:19] Speaker A: So just in case you're wondering, she extends this to her friends. [00:41:22] Speaker B: Becca, does that give me life? [00:41:24] Speaker C: For a small fee, you can contact me, and I will match make you or your you with a book. I'm just kidding. [00:41:29] Speaker B: That's awesome. [00:41:31] Speaker A: I think. What is giving me life? Yes. I love to read, but what is giving me life in this season is something that I did not want to do, but now that I'm doing it, I love it, which is. My husband is super into indoor cycling. For years, I was like, yeah, that's your thing. And then I started going with him. And in the heat of the summer in Memphis, being able to exercise in an air conditioned facility with bathrooms and a water fountain has been beautiful. So, still finding ways to move without having to feel like we're going to collapse in the humidity. [00:42:03] Speaker B: And also, come on, Becca, you have to tell them what you shared at staff meeting this week about how you. [00:42:08] Speaker A: My big milestone. [00:42:09] Speaker B: You're moving on up, girl. [00:42:11] Speaker A: You can turn the monitor on or not at the studio that we ride at, and if you do, it tells you your place in the class. And so I've been writing there for a couple years now, and I used to always have the monitor on, and always I was either last place or second to last place. And I was like, that's okay. I'm still gonna keep showing up. And then I decided one day, like, I'm not gonna turn the monitor on anymore. It's not helping me. I'm just riding. So I did that for a long time. Sometime last week, I was like, I'm just curious. So I just turn it on. I hadn't been. Hadn't been in about a week, so I wasn't feeling my best. I wasn't my strongest. It was a little bit of a. Ooph getting back into it, and I was number 13 out of 17. So I was, what? [00:42:50] Speaker B: What? [00:42:50] Speaker A: Doing better than at least four people. [00:42:52] Speaker B: Our girl is kicking some four people's tushies. You better watch out. [00:42:56] Speaker A: Number coming on 13. She's number 13. [00:42:59] Speaker C: She's coming for you. [00:43:00] Speaker B: She's coming for you. I love it. Okay, I'll close this out. What's giving me life right now is I'm literally chasing the sun. It was an incredibly busy beginning to the summer. Not enough outdoor time for me, not enough vitamin D. Really, really busy work schedule. There was some transition, just a lot, lot going on. And a couple of days ago, I was like, I have to get some vitamin D. At least 45 minutes outside in the sun every single day this month if I can manage it. And it is ridiculous how much better I feel. So in real time, what's giving me life is literally vitamin D in the sunshine outside. [00:43:40] Speaker C: You've kept giving yourself over to the heat wave. [00:43:44] Speaker B: I know I did. Exactly. I told my girlfriend, I was like, all I need now is my baby oil and my Sun-in, which is like, such an eighties thing, for sure. She's like, do not. I'm like, I'm just kidding. I put sunscreen on. Okay, well, thank you guys for this conversation and for those of y'all that are listening, we appreciate you guys joining us and hope that this has been helpful and encouraging. My last little closing thoughts or give yourself grace. Give those you're parenting with grace and have the long journey in mind. So thanks for joining us today. [00:44:18] Speaker A: We hope you enjoyed this episode. If you did, the best way to support us going forward is to subscribe. We'd love to hear from you. Leave a review, drop us a comment, or email us to let us know what you hope to hear in future episodes. Thank you to Kyle Wright, who edits and engineers all of our audio, and Tad Juitt, the creator of our music, on behalf of everyone at ETC. Thanks for listening, and we'll see you next time on the empowered to connect podcast. Until then, we're holding on to hope with you.